MBA Advisor: Handicapping Your Elite MBA Odds

This 26-year-old professional has spent the past five years in ever increasing roles of responsibilty at General Motors in sales and marketing IT. With a computer science degree from Northwestern, she also has felt strongly about promoting the idea of women in tech fields. Her ultimate post-MBA goal: To lead the way for gender parity in industry. “In a perfect world I’d shake up someplace like Google on this issue,” she says.

He’s a 33-year-old Korean entrepreneur who has worked two years in venture capital and spent two years in his country’s military. With a 3.97 GPA from UC-Berkeley and a GMAT score of between 730 and 760 on practice tests, he’s hoping to leverage an MBA into a job with a major VC firm in the U.S.

This 27-year-old Asian American professional will have spent five years in the insurance industry, most recently as a product mangement analyst. He likes the industry and plans to return to it once he earns his MBA, with the ultimate goal of becoming a CEO of a Top Ten property & casualty player in the industry.

Do they have the raw stats and experience to get in? Or will they get dinged by their dream schools?

Sandy is back again to analyze these and a few other profiles of actual MBA applicants who have shared their vital statistics, work backgrounds and career goals with Poets&Quants.

As usual, Kreisberg handicaps each potential applicant’s odds of getting into a top-ranked business school. If you include your own stats and characteristics in the comments, we’ll pick a few more and have Kreisberg assess your chances in a follow-up feature to be published shortly. (Please add your age and be clear on the sequence of your jobs in relaying work experience. Make sure you let us know your current job.)

And if you just have a short question, he is happy to answer that, too. So just post it in the comment section below.

Ms. GM Geek (& More) Wants To Sell Stuff To Real People — Tons To Like Except For GPA & GRE (Well, There Is Always Something)

330 GRE, 165Q 165V 5AWA.
3.2 GPA
(Was not prepared for the engineering curriculum, but received a 3.52 the last 2 years)
Undergraduate degree in computer science from Northwestern University
Work experience includes five years at General Motors in sales, marketing IT; started as a developer, promoted to requirements analyst and then systems analyst
“I’m the ‘face’ of our dev team to business stakeholders, constantly translating biz-to-tech and tech-to-biz. I’ve worked with teams in Canada, Mexico, Brazil, Germany, and the UK. Lots of soft skill work getting the ‘suits’ and the engineers to play nice. Youngest person in this role by 10+ years, often the youngest person in the room by 20+ years”
Extracurricular involvment in club ice hockey in college, plus swimming for two years of post-graduate work; ran own college admissions counseling business on the side; guest speaker with girls-in-STEM advocacy groups
Short-Term Goal: To pivot to product marketing management at a FAANG-level firm, continuing my woman-in-tech representation work, hopefully with company support. “I want to sell apps to real people, not just fellow geeks.”
Long-Term Goal: To become a CMO at a FAANG-level firm and “continue to lead the way for gender parity in the industry. In a perfect world I’d shake up someplace like Google on this issue.”
White 26-year-old American female

Odds of Success:

Wharton: 30% to 40%
Yale SOM: 30% to 40%
Berkeley: 30% to 40%+
Michigan: 50%+
Virginia: 50%+
UCLA: 50%+
Duke: 50%+
Cornell: 50%+

Sandy’s Analysis: Wow!

This is one of the most informative, clear, and well-written write-ups I’ve come across. Super lots to like including long (5 years), rising gigs at General Motors in Sales Marketing/IT (“developer, requirements analyst and then systems analyst”).

“I’m the ‘face’ of our dev team to business stakeholders, constantly translating biz-to-tech and tech-to-biz . . . . Lots of soft skill work getting the ‘suits’ and the engineers to play nice. Youngest person in this role by 10+ years, often the youngest person in the room by 20+ years.”

Great way to put it. Not sure I fully understand your technical role, but neither will most adcoms, and you can explain it more in other parts of the application.

General Motors, that boring rust belt company, still gets B-school attention for many obvious reasons, and there is probably a ‘Manufacturing Rust Belt Caucus’ at most B-schools which appreciates the legacy value and quant things those companies do — like aactually make stuff and sell it—and I mean make and sell stuff that is bigger than a phone.

You’ve also got another very positive stream in your story–woman in STEM: “I’ve done guest speaking stints with girls-in-STEM advocacy groups and served as an admissions interviewer for female STEM applicants for my alma mater [Northwestern]. I’m one of the few female GM reps at a local flagship university hackathon we help sponsor every year.”

Adcoms dig that for several reasons. Most adcoms are women-NOT-in STEM and they appreciate the rarity and salute your efforts to lend a helping hand. They also can visualize you as one of those class members who could help the Liberal Arts dunderheads get through any of the more demanding, quanty, STEM-Y parts of the first-year curriculum.

Well, good, good, good but this wouldn’t be fun if there also were not two boo-boos in your profile. In this case two concerning BOO-boos (one bigger than the other), viz.:

“330 GRE, 165Q 165V . . .[THAT IS SORTA A 710-720 GMAT],
3.2 in computer science from Northwestern. (Was not prepared for the engineering curriculum. 3.52 the last 2 years.)”

With that calling card, you are interested in attending:

Wharton (3.6, 730)
Yale SOM 3.6, 725)
Haas (3.6, 717)
Ross (3.4, 708)
Anderson (3.5, 715)
Darden (3.5, 712)
Fuqua (3.4, 695)
Johnson (3.3, 700)

Let’s just make that all simple. The work experience and extras and nice person parts of your story are A+.

The stats part, in simple terms, is that your ~710 GMAT (transliterated from your GRE scores) and 3.2 GPA are middling on the GMAT front for most schools you target while the GPA (3.2) IS BELOW THE REPORTED GPA OF ALL SCHOOLS YOU TARGET.

How much does your sterling career at General Motors and Women-in-STEM positives outweigh a rather modest GMAT/GPA?

I would say a good deal, largely because your GMAT/GPA is “swallowable” for most adcoms because it is pretty close to school averages. And the rest of your story is super. And there is no doubt of your ability to do the work at any school, so swallowing in this case is just swallowing whatever quantum hit they will take in the magazine rankings.

Let’s take Wharton. Like every school they will love your story. Will they “swallow” your 3.2/710? I think they might. For one thing, they got a huge class, so any reputational hit, small to begin with, will be even smaller. And as noted, there is no question you could do the work, even the quant work (such as it is over there).

Yale will do the same analysis, and to the extent that Yale has become one of the most GMAT concerned schools of the CE, they will chuckle over the fact that in your case, it is actually a GRE score, soooooooo, they do not have to report that in the all-important GMAT column.

The other schools on your list will be doing the same analysis. I think for them, it is just a matter of proving to them that you want to come. You’d be a strong applicant.

Korean Entrepreneur & Former VC Denied U.S. Asylum Wants Back Into U.S. With An MBA

730-760 GMAT range on practice tests
3.97 GPA
Undergraduate degree from Berkeley in environmental economics & policy — Transferred to UC-Berkeley from a community college, finishing undergrad education at 28
Work experience includes two years in the Korean military where he was discharged as a sergeant and two years at a venture capital firm in Korea. Also launched an online education platform similar to Khan Academy in Korea which was named the most innovative company in education and sold in 2017
Extracurricular involvment teaching LGBT children, started a local adopt-a-student program at an LGBT center in Korea
“Filed for asylum in U..S based on sexual identity, and the fact that the Korean military legally criminalizes gay soldiers. Was denied the asylum, so had to voluntarily leave U.S. and do my last semester in Korea”
“Parents cut ties with me when I came out, and was homeless for a year. Had to drop out of high school and took the Korean GED instead in my early 20’s. Also, paid through college on my own, and that’s why it took me eight years to finish college”
Short-Term Goal: To break into a major U.S. VC firm, and to be better equipped to launch a start-up
Long-Term Goal: To start a private foundation for LGBT kids in Korea.
33-year-old Korean gay male/li>

Odds of Success:

Harvard: 10%
Stanford: 10%
Wharton: 20%
MIT: 20%
Chicago: 20%
Berkeley: 20% to 30%
Yale: 20% to 30%

Sandy’s Analysis: Grrrr. Lots to like but not sure how adcoms will react to this story which seems like a backdoor to getting back into the USA. One important issue is, WHAT ARE YOU DOING NOW?

Your narrative above breaks off after you sold your online company in 2017. If you are still partying with the proceeds, that could be bad.

Your age at 33 is also a real negative. You fall outside the window of most of the programs you are targeting. They prefer people who are between 26 and 29.

You say your goal is to break into a major venture capital firm in the U.S. and to be better equipped to launch a start-up.

I dunno about that goal. Your chances of attending a U.S. school at age 34 and graduating at age 36 and THEN looking for a VC job at age 36 is a stretch. Well, it could happen if you found a firm that could put your valuable expertise to work on Day 1. The fact that you worked for a Korean VC firm could make a transition easier, especially if the firm was a top-tier player.

But your real problem is getting into an MBA program, not so much getting a VC job.

All that said, a 3.97 GPA from Berk, plus some 750+ GMAT score, well that is the kind of soap that washes away a lot of questions. I could see Sloan overlooking your age and maybe Booth.

You may need to assure Haas and Yale that you will actually attend. Not seeing this at HBS or Stanford. You are competing with non-URM guys in VC, an ultra competitive bucket, and for which H and S have to satisfy their frequent flyer feeder firms as well. On the other hand, if anyone at H or S really liked you, well, they will find a way to admit you.

Your biggest problem is explaining your need for an MBA given your age, and the fact you have already worked in VC and ALSO started and sold a couple of companies.

How come you don’t just apply for jobs at international VC firms operating in Korea? I think you might be able to kick something up.
We know you want to get back to the USA, but that is a truth that dare not speak its name.

No problem being Gay, as I am sure you realized at Berkeley.

This Dude Loves Insurance But Are His Job & Post-MBA Goals Glittery Enough For Adcoms?

680 GMAT (47Q/35V)
3.5 GPA (3.8 at community college & a 3.14 at UC-Riverside while taking care of a sick family member)
Undergraduate degree in business administration
Work experience will include five years in insurance, with one and one-half years as a wealth advisor at Guardian Life, then three and one-half years at AAA Insurance as a product management analyst
“The product management role marries two interests of mine: data analytics and the ability to work on executive-level projects within our company.This position required a high level of team collaboration with many other business units and is considered one of the more prestigious within the company. I have plenty of quantitatively back examples of the impact I have had. Also, I created a Autonomous Vehicle Task Force, which has several executives and senior managers as participants. Autonomous Vehicles is an area that may destroy car insurance in the next 20 years and this is the area that I want to make an impact on in the long run”
Extracurricular involvement as vice president of a Young Entrepreneur’s organization for four years; also founded and manged volunteer program in which more thn 2,300 hours have been volunteered in the local community over the past two and one-half years
Short-Term Goal: To get into the corporate development program at Liberty Mutual Insurance
Long-Term Goal: To climb the ranks to CEO of a Top Ten property and casualty insurance company
27-year-old Asian American male

Odds of Success:

Northwestern: 20%
Michigan: 20% to 30%
Duke: 20% to 30%
Virginia: 20% to 30%
NYU: 20%
UCLA: 20%
Cornell: 20% to 30%

Sandy’s Analysis: Tough love alert. I like you and we all need insurance and you have a tight resume supporting your interest and experience in the industry. All that said, however, adcoms at selective business schools don’t see kids who want to be a product manager at Liberty Mutual as their post-MBA goal as the glittering lights of the incoming class.

In light of the fact that they get with the programs themselves and dmit someone like you, you might meet then half way and try to get a better GMAT score, given that both your GMAT and GPA currently are on the average to low side for your target schools.

I do not think a leadership development program at Liberty Mutual is glittery. Glittery means hard to get jobs in private equity or in ‘hot’ companies like Apple or Google or exciting startups with venture capital funding. Hey, there are lots of solid and good things in the world besides glitter, but I’m just saying that adcoms like something that sparkles.

Sure, Liberty Mutual is a Fortune 255 company, but the real issue is not where a company sits on the Fortune ranking. The real issue is selectivity and how hard it is to get a job there. As noted, insurance is something we all have and need but so is running water. Most adcoms view insurance as the commodity part of finance versus PE or even (cough) investment banking.

Another issue, which is partly BS and partly real, is that schools like to see themselves as having a ‘transforming’ impact on students. In the case of someone from insurance, that would mean you enter as an insurance guy and leave as an investment banking guy. One kick up the status ladder.

Monday, September 10, 2018

Handicapping Your Elite MBA Odds - Poets&Quants

Ms. GM Geek (& More) Wants To Sell Stuff To Real People — Tons To Like Except For GPA & GRE (Well, There Is Always Something)

Korean Entrepreneur & Former VC Denied U.S. Asylum Wants Back Into U.S. With An MBA

This Dude Loves Insurance But Are His Job & Post-MBA Goals Glittery Enough For Adcoms?

Handicapping Your MBA Odds – The Entire Series

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